Q: What about the PM’s current strategy? It to be, keep your head down, try not to cause trouble with Trump?

Turnbull:

It’s not a question of causing trouble, right? And there is – I noticed, you know, I gave a pretty mundane, I thought, interview with Bloomberg the other day and markets and geopolitics and we talked about Trump and Trump was obviously watching and took exception to it and put out a post having a go at me. Which, as you can see, shattered me. (LAUGHTER) But it didn’t shatter me very much but, ohs, you know, you saw the media. Malcolm Turnbull has ruined the chance of the tariffs and it created the most terrible tension at Holt Street. Who are we going to blame for the steel and aluminium tariffs? Albo? Malcolm? Kevin Rudd? And if we blame Kevin we can’t blame the other two. If we blame Malcolm, we can’t blame Albo. As it happened, nobody got an exemption, which is what I predicted. We’ve got to stop running around pretending that there is not an issue here andively sense organise ourselves. Does Donald Trump self-censor himself? Of course he doesn’t. If you want to be respected by people like Trump, you have to stand up for yourself, full stop. I’m not in the first bloom of youth and Trump is not the first bullying billionaire I’ve dealt with over the years so I can tell you I’m confident in this judgement.

Q: You say you have to be tough to deal with Donald Trump. Peter Dutton, you know, says he’s the guy to do that. He can stand up to Trump and also forge a productive working relationship. Anthony Albanese is struggling to get a call with Trump. Maybe that won’t hurt him. In the long run, depending on what happens with the tariffs decision. But from your perspective, who would be the better leader to deal with Donald Trump.

Turnbull:

I honestly couldn’t pick between them, really. Being frank with you, I think it’s really hard to say. I think Dutton has a particular challenge, it’s a two-edged sword for Dutton. On the one hand, he would say, “I’ve got a great relationship with Gina Rinehart. She’s a friend, one of the biggest donors to the Liberal Party and to Dutton’s cause and she’s made a beeline for Trump and,” and he would say he’s got access to Trump through those connections. I don’t think it would do you any good but that’s sort of the pitch and that’s the kind of thing that, you know, frankly, on the right-wing media, that is the line that is being put.

Dutton is closer to Trump politically and therefore would be able to deal better with him. That’s one side of the coin. On the other side of the coin, the problem Peter has is that his political environment is that right-wing media ecosystem, you know, Sky After Dark, shock jocks, Murdoch tabloids, your paper (the Australian) That’s part of the world in which he operates and it’s all tied up with Fox News intimately connected to the Trump Administration, so the difficulty of taking on Trump is you’re then taking on the most popular person in the ecosystem in which you live, OK? So I think the only way you’ll find out is if he becomes prime minister and does that

Albanese doesn’t have that. He doesn’t have the advantage of great connections through, you know, plutocrats and billionaires but he also doesn’t have the problem that his political base, his media environment, if you like, is, you know, fan boys for Donald Trump.

On Peter Dutton saying he wants a ‘whole squadron of F-35s’ Turnbull says:

I’m not saying that is the particular right decision. I notice Peter Dutton has said he wants to buy a new Squadron of them. You certainly shouldn’t be saying that, I wouldn’t have thought. It sends quite the wrong signal but this is why we need to have a proper conversation about this and this is what we were having yesterday. But you can’t keep on pretending it’s not happening. There is a big – moving to another marine metaphor, there is a big whale in the bay called Donald Trump, splashing around, wetting everybody and creating mayhem and our political class are pretending it’s not there.

Q: I think one of the issues with plan B is there’s not many sort of credible options given that Australia’s record on submarines is burning everyone who has offered to sell us one essentially. We saw, obviously, your predecessor, Tony Abbott, with the wink and the handshake deal with the Japanese. Obviously torched the relationship with the French over the attack class. We talk about the need for a plan B but what is a realistic plan B, given…

Turnbull:

Look, you cannot deal with a risk unless you acknowledge it exists. This is the fundamental problem that they’re literally in denial. I won’t say who it was but I was speaking to have a very senior official in this area the other day and I said, “What is your plan if the Virginias do not arrive,” and he looked me straight in the eye and he said to me, “They will arrive.” And I said that’s actually not the answer to the question I asked. I said what will you do if they don’t. He said, “They will arrive.” After he said it a few times this is like me saying to you, “I am having a party in the park or the garden, on Sunday and invite you,” and if you say, “What are you going to do if it rains?” And I say, “It won’t rain.”

We have a real risk here that is contemplated by the parties. It is real. It’s set out. It’s been flagged by the new deputy secretary of defence, in his confirmation hearings. It’s self-evident. But denial. Here’s the problem.

You’re right. The alternative submarine plans are difficult but they’re not even being looked at. Doing nothing, however, is even worse because then you have nothing. At least if you say, alright, the odds are we’re not going to get any subs, let’s acquire some other long-range capabilities that may not be as effective but at least do something. It is as though the Government and Opposition are frozen in bipartisan at the oar of admitting the truth. That’s the problem and where the system is failing us. Bipartisanship is all very well but not when the two sides of politics are united in error.

The former prime minister is addressing the press club where he is talking about what he believes Australia needs to do when it comes to the US.

This is a bit of a victory lap for Turnbull who has been a critic of Aukus from the beginning because of the impact to Australia’s sovereignty. Turnbull was among the first voices to raise questions about how much control Australia would have over any submarines it may receive under the deal (he is also doubtful we will get any) and what that would mean for Australia’s own decision making in conflicts.

He was pretty much ignored, but with the Trump administration showing exactly what American foreign policy is like when the mask is off, suddenly, everyone wants to hear from Turnbull. And he is happy to oblige.

If the big parties won’t face reality, it may be that Australians will need the crossbench, assuming they have the balance of power, to demand a thorough and urgent assessment of the state of the AUKUS submarine project, a rigorous analysis of the risks and a clear assessment of the measures and alternative options available to address those risks. Hope is not a strategy. It’s better described at danger’s comforter, a solace for those who have already lost. We need a plan B. And not one where the B stands for blindness, as in wilful blindness.

The pair have agreed to a debate at the Sky News/Daily Telegraph People’s Forum for next Tuesday night. So I guess we will see you next Tuesday (boom, tish!)

Anthony Albanese is taking advice from Daniel Andrews

Peter Dutton is taking advice from Tony Abbott/Peta Credlin (they are basically the same person) and Scott Morrison.

FUN TIMES.

Q: The Prime Minister ruled out negotiating over PBS and said you won’t undermine our biosecurity, would you like to see any of those other negotiating tables to secure an exemption for the next round?

Dutton:

No, and I agree with the Prime Minister’s position and I would say this that I will stand up for our country’s interest every day, if given the great honour of being Prime Minister of this country I will not compromise in relation to issues that have national significance and importance to us. I will always make the decision to keep our country safe and I’ll stand up for our interest and negotiate the best possible outcome for Australia and I will not compromise on any of that for our country.

On the tariffs, Dutton walks a very fine line:

The President of the United States will stand up for America, I’ll stand up for Australia. It seems the Prime Minister is not able to stand up for our national security and is not able to stand up for homebuyers, is not able to stand up for families, he is not able to stand up against people who are trying to do a deal that is not in our country’s best interest. I have the strength of leadership and experience to be able to stand up to the President of the United States or anyone else if they are acting against our countries interest and I… I will always take the best interest of our country is the objective is Prime Minister and I think I have demonstrated that we negotiated to the AUKUS agreement and stood up for ourselves in international fora. That is it that I would do.

Q: On your lending for policy for both homebuyers, what kind of buffer percentagewise do you think is acceptable, 3%?

Dutton:

Ultimately it is a decision for APRA but our position is to make sure that you can get into housing as quickly as possible. That is the first principle. Why are we making announcement? I want young Australians to achieve the dream of home ownership that is managed under the Albanese government. We think potential arrangements are in place at the moment that are too difficult for young homebuyers. I’ve made this point many times but I’m not going to be a prime minister as Mr Albanese is that is happy with the housing market were only those kids with a Bank of Mum and Dad can buy a home. That is not my dream for our country, my dream is to help a young Australian into a house to achieve the dream of home ownership and we do that through a number of measures. Our $5 billion plan to help infrastructure and that will create 500,000 new homes, to put the 2-year ban in place for foreign buyers and also make sure we have a well-managed migration program and to make sure we can help younger Australians.

This announcement would only send housing prices even higher, because suddenly you’ll have a whole heap more people able to borrow.

Also the lending criteria was cut because of the horror stories during the banking royal commission, which showed the trouble people got in and the potential for a housing bubble

Q: Is Peter Dutton a drag on the vote in Victoria?

Dutton:

I have seen the Prime Minister ‘s numbers and he is not far off when Jacinta Allan is in Victoria at the moment and people know in relation to this project that if you vote for Anthony Albanese you are voting against this Melbourne rail link and the airport link and that much, Victorians can see on display every day because you’ve got Jacinta Allan, Anthony Albanese and the CFMEU joint of the hip.

I am breaking that up. I am breaking the cabal up for the benefit of Victorians. I’m going to invest into Victoria, I’m going to put money into infrastructure. We’re going to get our great state again. At the moment I think we can win a number of seats and I think we can form government consistently and we will demonstrate to Victorians and Australians that there is a much better way for our country.

Q: In February are you prepared to call an RBA to cut rates again?

Dutton:

As we know, interest rates have gone up 12 times under Mr Anthony Albanese so families are worse off under this government and I think that’s important to point out. When the Prime Minister is promising 70 cents a day tax cut in 15 months time, he is saying that to families that he has taken $50,000 over the course of the last three years and that is why I think it is insulting Australians see it as insulting. We are saying to Australians we want to provide support now way of the 20 sent — 25 cents a litre tax cut for fuel and that will help families immediately and the things we want to do but in relation to interest rates, I’ve always pointed out the Reserve Bank governor has independence. I’ve always respected that. I want to see lower interest rates are families at the best way to get low interest rates in this country and to help families is to support your liberal and national candidates of the next election because as we know with this government and as a Reserve Bank governor has pointed out, homegrown inflation is because of Labor’s reckless spending and waste. We don’t see this in comparable countries. We are seeing it here because Labor continue to put pressure on inflation and that is what puts upward pressure…

Inflation is going down on all measures.

Comparable countries saw inflation rise earlier and their central banks raise rates earlier so it is not surprising that inflation which came later to Australia, and where the RBA raised rates later, drop later than comparable countries.

The fuel excise savings have been overestimated.

Q: Members of your party have raised concern about your side of the campaign so far, we saw some polling that raised concerns that there has been a bit of a downward turn about not really getting the message out why Australians should vote for the Coalition. The case has been made that Labor is a bad government but the public is not convinced that the Coalition is a good option.

Dutton:

I think you haven’t seen anything yet, wait till we get into this campaign and you see more of what we have to offer and you see the government is offering in terms of increasing taxes on prices, when you see the two parties by election day you will see a prime ministerial candidate who will be able to protect and defend our country when the Prime Minister is too weak to do so. Y

You will see a prime ministerial candidate who is able to make a decision is required to get our economy back on track and to reduce inflation to make sure that we can restore the dream of home ownership, where the Prime Minister has taken a dream away from Australians and I will lead a team into the next election which is experienced and which has the ability not just to clean up Labor’s mass but to implement our positive plan and that is evidence today by what is a once-in-a-generation opportunity for Victorians to get this rail link built and it will be built under a coalition government. It will not be built under an Albanese government and that much is obvious to every Victorian and will have more to say the country.